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	<title>Comments on: Resting Comfortably</title>
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	<link>http://malcolmpollack.com/2009/06/27/resting-comfortably/</link>
	<description>I go many places...</description>
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		<title>By: jack</title>
		<link>http://malcolmpollack.com/2009/06/27/resting-comfortably/comment-page-1/#comment-151524</link>
		<dc:creator>jack</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Jun 2009 05:47:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://malcolmpollack.com/2009/06/27/resting-comfortably/#comment-151524</guid>
		<description>Apologies, I thought I had read his obituary. Glad to be wrong!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Apologies, I thought I had read his obituary. Glad to be wrong!</p>
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		<title>By: bob koepp</title>
		<link>http://malcolmpollack.com/2009/06/27/resting-comfortably/comment-page-1/#comment-151520</link>
		<dc:creator>bob koepp</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Jun 2009 03:34:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://malcolmpollack.com/2009/06/27/resting-comfortably/#comment-151520</guid>
		<description>An allergic reaction to consensus might not be a bad thing. It probably depends on what basis the consensus has. If the consensus smacks more of the political than the epistemological, then it&#039;s just another idol of the marketplace.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>An allergic reaction to consensus might not be a bad thing. It probably depends on what basis the consensus has. If the consensus smacks more of the political than the epistemological, then it&#8217;s just another idol of the marketplace.</p>
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		<title>By: Malcolm</title>
		<link>http://malcolmpollack.com/2009/06/27/resting-comfortably/comment-page-1/#comment-151518</link>
		<dc:creator>Malcolm</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Jun 2009 03:05:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://malcolmpollack.com/2009/06/27/resting-comfortably/#comment-151518</guid>
		<description>You&#039;re right, though, Jack - Dyson does appear to agree that human activities have contributed to global warming.  I went off half-cocked there; as I had recalled, he didn&#039;t. I stand corrected.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You&#8217;re right, though, Jack &#8211; Dyson does appear to agree that human activities have contributed to global warming.  I went off half-cocked there; as I had recalled, he didn&#8217;t. I stand corrected.</p>
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		<title>By: Malcolm</title>
		<link>http://malcolmpollack.com/2009/06/27/resting-comfortably/comment-page-1/#comment-151517</link>
		<dc:creator>Malcolm</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Jun 2009 02:00:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://malcolmpollack.com/2009/06/27/resting-comfortably/#comment-151517</guid>
		<description>Dyson&#039;s still around. That past tense had me worried for a minute there.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dyson&#8217;s still around. That past tense had me worried for a minute there.</p>
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		<title>By: jack</title>
		<link>http://malcolmpollack.com/2009/06/27/resting-comfortably/comment-page-1/#comment-151516</link>
		<dc:creator>jack</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Jun 2009 01:29:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://malcolmpollack.com/2009/06/27/resting-comfortably/#comment-151516</guid>
		<description>Dyson had an allergy to scientific consensus. In any case, as far as I can tell, Dyson believed in human-caused climate change, but didn&#039;t think it was much worth worrying about. ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freeman_Dyson)

There might be serious dissent within the scientific community, but I&#039;m not sure that this WSJ article demonstrates this.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dyson had an allergy to scientific consensus. In any case, as far as I can tell, Dyson believed in human-caused climate change, but didn&#8217;t think it was much worth worrying about. ( <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freeman_Dyson)" rel="nofollow">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freeman_Dyson)</a></p>
<p>There might be serious dissent within the scientific community, but I&#8217;m not sure that this WSJ article demonstrates this.</p>
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		<title>By: Malcolm</title>
		<link>http://malcolmpollack.com/2009/06/27/resting-comfortably/comment-page-1/#comment-151514</link>
		<dc:creator>Malcolm</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Jun 2009 01:06:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://malcolmpollack.com/2009/06/27/resting-comfortably/#comment-151514</guid>
		<description>What made this article worth reading? Only that it&#039;s good to be reminded  --  given the hysteria surrounding AGW, the branding of skeptics as &quot;deniers&quot; (read: &quot;heretics&quot;, with a whiff also of Holocaust &quot;denial&quot;) and its use as a lever to enact all manner of large-scale social, political, and economic programs  --  that there is serious and genuine dissent within the scientific community. And you don&#039;t have to be a specialist to know politicized science, or questionable science generally, when you see it; when somebody like Freeman Dyson, for example, having listened to the debate, announces that he thinks there is good reason to be skeptical, I think it is worth noting. 

I&#039;m not taking sides here, by the way; as I said above, for all I know the consensus is correct. But there is a great deal more in play in this debate than just science; there are an awful lot of people who have vested interests and ulterior motives here, and the stakes are very high.

Thanks for the links. </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>What made this article worth reading? Only that it&#8217;s good to be reminded  &#8212;  given the hysteria surrounding AGW, the branding of skeptics as &#8220;deniers&#8221; (read: &#8220;heretics&#8221;, with a whiff also of Holocaust &#8220;denial&#8221;) and its use as a lever to enact all manner of large-scale social, political, and economic programs  &#8212;  that there is serious and genuine dissent within the scientific community. And you don&#8217;t have to be a specialist to know politicized science, or questionable science generally, when you see it; when somebody like Freeman Dyson, for example, having listened to the debate, announces that he thinks there is good reason to be skeptical, I think it is worth noting. </p>
<p>I&#8217;m not taking sides here, by the way; as I said above, for all I know the consensus is correct. But there is a great deal more in play in this debate than just science; there are an awful lot of people who have vested interests and ulterior motives here, and the stakes are very high.</p>
<p>Thanks for the links.</p>
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		<title>By: jack</title>
		<link>http://malcolmpollack.com/2009/06/27/resting-comfortably/comment-page-1/#comment-151513</link>
		<dc:creator>jack</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Jun 2009 00:38:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://malcolmpollack.com/2009/06/27/resting-comfortably/#comment-151513</guid>
		<description>The article doesn&#039;t give much evidence for its central claim that &quot;The number of skeptics, far from shrinking, is swelling.&quot; It mentions some groups of &quot;scientists&quot; who are skeptics, but what scientists, and with what expertise. It references a politician&#039;s count of 700 skeptic &quot;scientists&quot; but, forgive me if I&#039;m not impressed before seeing their names. 

Let&#039;s look at some of the claims:

&lt;blockquote&gt;&quot;Norway&#039;s Ivar Giaever, Nobel Prize winner for physics, decries it as the &quot;new religion.&quot; &lt;/blockquote&gt;

Well, whoopee. Giaever got his Nobel Prize for his research in superconductivity. How does that make him an expert on climate science? He was also born in 1929, and forgive me for speaking the plain truth, 80 year old men aren&#039;t really in top form...

&lt;blockquote&gt;Joanne Simpson, the world&#039;s first woman to receive a Ph.D. in meteorology, expressed relief upon her retirement last year that she was finally free to speak &quot;frankly&quot; of her nonbelief.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Joanne Simpson, born in 1923, is a meteorologist and worked for NASA. But what is the source for the WSJ&#039;s claim? Perhaps it is this &lt;a href=&quot;http://climatesci.org/2008/02/27/trmm-tropical-rainfall-measuring-mission-data-set-potential-in-climate-controversy-by-joanne-simpson-private-citizen/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;statement?&lt;/a&gt; What does she say? 

&lt;blockquote&gt;What should we as a nation do? Decisions have to be made on incomplete information. In this case, we must act on the recommendations of Gore and the IPCC because if we do not reduce emissions of greenhouse gases and the climate models are right, the planet as we know it will in this century become unsustainable. But as a scientist I remain skeptical.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

On, on, on to the next one:

&lt;blockquote&gt;Dr. Kiminori Itoh, a Japanese environmental physical chemist who contributed to a U.N. climate report, dubs man-made warming &quot;the worst scientific scandal in history.&quot;&lt;/blockquote&gt;

According to the &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.heartland.org/about/profileresults.html?profile=669FDE4DC9B945865224D8FE42DA9F7E&amp;directory=3B532E2483EE9165FD810C4DF38DBAEA&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Heartland Institute&lt;/a&gt;, which is as you know friendly towards skeptics, Dr. Kiminori Itoh is a PhD in Industrial Chemistry. He describes himself (in his own words) as a&lt;a href=&quot;http://climatesci.org/2008/06/17/guest-weblog-by-dr-kiminori-itoh-of-yokohama-national-university/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt; physical chemist familiar with environmental sciences, and not particularly specialized in climate science&lt;/a&gt;. Perhaps he knows what he&#039;s talking about, but Dr Itoh wouldn&#039;t be the first person I&#039;d think to ask about global warming, or the climate in general...

&lt;blockquote&gt;A group of 54 noted physicists, led by Princeton&#039;s Will Happer, is demanding the American Physical Society revise its position that the science is settled.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

I don&#039;t think any science should ever be &quot;settled&quot; if that is indeed the position of the American Physical Society. Will Happer is an interesting figure: he thinks we &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.powermag.com/blog/index.php/2009/02/25/will-happer-we-need-more-co2/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;need more CO2&lt;/a&gt;, for example, or so at least it is reported. But what about this list? You can  find it &lt;a href=&quot;http://epw.senate.gov/public/index.cfm?FuseAction=Minority.Blogs&amp;ContentRecord_id=5ef55aa3-802a-23ad-4ce4-89c4f49995d2&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;here&lt;/a&gt;. Interesting list, but it brags about adding a neuropharmacologist and a CNN weatherman to the list...so, um, ok. Have to examine the list a little more thoroughly. But if were were to make a list of global warming accepting climate scientists, how many would be on the list? Really, what do raw numbers mean without context. Without context, its just rhetoric.

&lt;blockquote&gt;The collapse of the &quot;consensus&quot; has been driven by reality.&lt;/blockquote&gt; There&#039;s been a collapse? From where? 

&lt;blockquote&gt;earth&#039;s temperatures have flat-lined since 2001, despite growing concentrations of C02&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Oh, I feel safer now, &#039;cause you know, 8 years will let me predict the next 80 years of global climate.

&lt;blockquote&gt;Peer-reviewed research has debunked doomsday scenarios about the polar ice caps, hurricanes, malaria, extinctions, rising oceans. &lt;/blockquote&gt;

Which doomsday scenarios, proposed by whom? Which peer-reviewed research? Published where? And, well, I&#039;m sure there&#039;s peer reviewed research that says the contrary.Oh yeah, the IPCC stuff. But not just there.

&lt;blockquote&gt;A global financial crisis has politicians taking a harder look at the science that would require them to hamstring their economies to rein in carbon.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Suddenly, every thing is clear. Wall Street Journal, global financial crisis, ...



So what made this article worth reading, exactly?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The article doesn&#8217;t give much evidence for its central claim that &#8220;The number of skeptics, far from shrinking, is swelling.&#8221; It mentions some groups of &#8220;scientists&#8221; who are skeptics, but what scientists, and with what expertise. It references a politician&#8217;s count of 700 skeptic &#8220;scientists&#8221; but, forgive me if I&#8217;m not impressed before seeing their names. </p>
<p>Let&#8217;s look at some of the claims:</p>
<blockquote><p>&#8220;Norway&#8217;s Ivar Giaever, Nobel Prize winner for physics, decries it as the &#8220;new religion.&#8221; </p></blockquote>
<p>Well, whoopee. Giaever got his Nobel Prize for his research in superconductivity. How does that make him an expert on climate science? He was also born in 1929, and forgive me for speaking the plain truth, 80 year old men aren&#8217;t really in top form&#8230;</p>
<blockquote><p>Joanne Simpson, the world&#8217;s first woman to receive a Ph.D. in meteorology, expressed relief upon her retirement last year that she was finally free to speak &#8220;frankly&#8221; of her nonbelief.</p></blockquote>
<p>Joanne Simpson, born in 1923, is a meteorologist and worked for NASA. But what is the source for the WSJ&#8217;s claim? Perhaps it is this <a href="http://climatesci.org/2008/02/27/trmm-tropical-rainfall-measuring-mission-data-set-potential-in-climate-controversy-by-joanne-simpson-private-citizen/" rel="nofollow">statement?</a> What does she say? </p>
<blockquote><p>What should we as a nation do? Decisions have to be made on incomplete information. In this case, we must act on the recommendations of Gore and the IPCC because if we do not reduce emissions of greenhouse gases and the climate models are right, the planet as we know it will in this century become unsustainable. But as a scientist I remain skeptical.</p></blockquote>
<p>On, on, on to the next one:</p>
<blockquote><p>Dr. Kiminori Itoh, a Japanese environmental physical chemist who contributed to a U.N. climate report, dubs man-made warming &#8220;the worst scientific scandal in history.&#8221;</p></blockquote>
<p>According to the <a href="http://www.heartland.org/about/profileresults.html?profile=669FDE4DC9B945865224D8FE42DA9F7E&amp;directory=3B532E2483EE9165FD810C4DF38DBAEA" rel="nofollow">Heartland Institute</a>, which is as you know friendly towards skeptics, Dr. Kiminori Itoh is a PhD in Industrial Chemistry. He describes himself (in his own words) as a<a href="http://climatesci.org/2008/06/17/guest-weblog-by-dr-kiminori-itoh-of-yokohama-national-university/" rel="nofollow"> physical chemist familiar with environmental sciences, and not particularly specialized in climate science</a>. Perhaps he knows what he&#8217;s talking about, but Dr Itoh wouldn&#8217;t be the first person I&#8217;d think to ask about global warming, or the climate in general&#8230;</p>
<blockquote><p>A group of 54 noted physicists, led by Princeton&#8217;s Will Happer, is demanding the American Physical Society revise its position that the science is settled.</p></blockquote>
<p>I don&#8217;t think any science should ever be &#8220;settled&#8221; if that is indeed the position of the American Physical Society. Will Happer is an interesting figure: he thinks we <a href="http://www.powermag.com/blog/index.php/2009/02/25/will-happer-we-need-more-co2/" rel="nofollow">need more CO2</a>, for example, or so at least it is reported. But what about this list? You can  find it <a href="http://epw.senate.gov/public/index.cfm?FuseAction=Minority.Blogs&amp;ContentRecord_id=5ef55aa3-802a-23ad-4ce4-89c4f49995d2" rel="nofollow">here</a>. Interesting list, but it brags about adding a neuropharmacologist and a CNN weatherman to the list&#8230;so, um, ok. Have to examine the list a little more thoroughly. But if were were to make a list of global warming accepting climate scientists, how many would be on the list? Really, what do raw numbers mean without context. Without context, its just rhetoric.</p>
<blockquote><p>The collapse of the &#8220;consensus&#8221; has been driven by reality.</p></blockquote>
<p> There&#8217;s been a collapse? From where? </p>
<blockquote><p>earth&#8217;s temperatures have flat-lined since 2001, despite growing concentrations of C02</p></blockquote>
<p>Oh, I feel safer now, &#8217;cause you know, 8 years will let me predict the next 80 years of global climate.</p>
<blockquote><p>Peer-reviewed research has debunked doomsday scenarios about the polar ice caps, hurricanes, malaria, extinctions, rising oceans. </p></blockquote>
<p>Which doomsday scenarios, proposed by whom? Which peer-reviewed research? Published where? And, well, I&#8217;m sure there&#8217;s peer reviewed research that says the contrary.Oh yeah, the IPCC stuff. But not just there.</p>
<blockquote><p>A global financial crisis has politicians taking a harder look at the science that would require them to hamstring their economies to rein in carbon.</p></blockquote>
<p>Suddenly, every thing is clear. Wall Street Journal, global financial crisis, &#8230;</p>
<p>So what made this article worth reading, exactly?</p>
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		<title>By: JK</title>
		<link>http://malcolmpollack.com/2009/06/27/resting-comfortably/comment-page-1/#comment-151508</link>
		<dc:creator>JK</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Jun 2009 19:06:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://malcolmpollack.com/2009/06/27/resting-comfortably/#comment-151508</guid>
		<description>I&#039;ve said it before.... well, HL &lt;em&gt;actually&lt;/em&gt; wrote it but, well you know:

“Civilization, in fact, grows more and more maudlin and hysterical; especially under democracy it tends to degenerate into a mere combat of crazes; the whole aim of practical politics is to keep the populace alarmed (and hence clamorous to be led to safety) by an endless series of hobgoblins, most of them imaginary.”</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;ve said it before&#8230;. well, HL <em>actually</em> wrote it but, well you know:</p>
<p>“Civilization, in fact, grows more and more maudlin and hysterical; especially under democracy it tends to degenerate into a mere combat of crazes; the whole aim of practical politics is to keep the populace alarmed (and hence clamorous to be led to safety) by an endless series of hobgoblins, most of them imaginary.”</p>
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		<title>By: Malcolm</title>
		<link>http://malcolmpollack.com/2009/06/27/resting-comfortably/comment-page-1/#comment-151501</link>
		<dc:creator>Malcolm</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Jun 2009 15:59:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://malcolmpollack.com/2009/06/27/resting-comfortably/#comment-151501</guid>
		<description>That&#039;s right, Bob, and that&#039;s what has bothered me also. For all I know, the &quot;consensus&quot; may indeed be correct  --  but the way the skeptics have been treated, for what are often clearly political reasons, has been shameful. 

There is always need for vigilance when ideologues seize upon an &quot;emergency&quot; to justify radical social or political action, whether it&#039;s the Great War (the excesses of the Wilson administration were, effectively, a period of Fascism in America), the Depression (the National Recovery Administration under FDR and Hugh &quot;Iron Pants&quot; Johnson was little better), the Reichstag fire, the current economic meltdown, or climate change. As Rahm Emanuel said, &quot;you don&#039;t ever want a crisis to go to waste.&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>That&#8217;s right, Bob, and that&#8217;s what has bothered me also. For all I know, the &#8220;consensus&#8221; may indeed be correct  &#8212;  but the way the skeptics have been treated, for what are often clearly political reasons, has been shameful. </p>
<p>There is always need for vigilance when ideologues seize upon an &#8220;emergency&#8221; to justify radical social or political action, whether it&#8217;s the Great War (the excesses of the Wilson administration were, effectively, a period of Fascism in America), the Depression (the National Recovery Administration under FDR and Hugh &#8220;Iron Pants&#8221; Johnson was little better), the Reichstag fire, the current economic meltdown, or climate change. As Rahm Emanuel said, &#8220;you don&#8217;t ever want a crisis to go to waste.&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: bob koepp</title>
		<link>http://malcolmpollack.com/2009/06/27/resting-comfortably/comment-page-1/#comment-151499</link>
		<dc:creator>bob koepp</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Jun 2009 12:04:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://malcolmpollack.com/2009/06/27/resting-comfortably/#comment-151499</guid>
		<description>I didn&#039;t start to question the &quot;consensus&quot; about AGW until I saw how critical voices were being shouted down with insults instead of arguments that addressed the questions raised by critics. The big loser, I think, is science itself.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I didn&#8217;t start to question the &#8220;consensus&#8221; about AGW until I saw how critical voices were being shouted down with insults instead of arguments that addressed the questions raised by critics. The big loser, I think, is science itself.</p>
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